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happy
WHAT THE HELL???
December 18, 2003 at 04:43AM View BBCode
Joe Horn attempts to call mother and children after a touchdown, and he asks why he is being fined? hey, your team isnt even making the playoffs, they suck, and you are trying to insult the other team by CALLING YOUR FAMILY. this is the kind of thing that pisses me off. nothing says unsportsmanlike better than this.
happy
December 18, 2003 at 04:45AM View BBCode
and also, something else that pisses me off, COLLEGE APPLICATIONS. apparantly i was supposed to turn something in to my counseler December 1st, and i didnt, not to mention i need a teacher to fill out a teacher recommendation form within the next week or two. why cant they just talk to me, figure out im a genious, and let me in:mad::mad::mad::mad:
sycophantman
Tell the players in the league that there will be no rules against showboating, but if another player from the other team lays you out, they won't fine him if it was justified.
It's the other players that should be asked 'does this bother you?'
I bet it won't be long before a player from the opposing team just flattens some fool for doing the 'dumbass shuffle'. And when that happes, the player who smacked the guy down will be roundly applauded by most football fans.
December 18, 2003 at 04:47AM View BBCode
I think that the only thing to be done about Joe Horn and his ilk is this.Tell the players in the league that there will be no rules against showboating, but if another player from the other team lays you out, they won't fine him if it was justified.
It's the other players that should be asked 'does this bother you?'
I bet it won't be long before a player from the opposing team just flattens some fool for doing the 'dumbass shuffle'. And when that happes, the player who smacked the guy down will be roundly applauded by most football fans.
Duff77
People around here will throw out free speech, free expression, and blah blah blah, but the nuts and bolts of it is that this Horn guy was being a jackass so people would talk about him, and that kind of behavior is repugnant. There should be a penalty for it. $30,000 is maybe a bit steep, given that what he did caused no injury to anyone, but I think some punishment is just.
December 18, 2003 at 04:50AM View BBCode
I've thought about this and I have to agree. Frankly I don't care if the guy calls his mom after he scores a touchdown, but at least go to the sideline first. The only reason to do it in endzone is to draw attention to yourself. I don't think it's an attempt to insult the other team, but I do think it's an attempt to get some name recognition by being a total jackass.People around here will throw out free speech, free expression, and blah blah blah, but the nuts and bolts of it is that this Horn guy was being a jackass so people would talk about him, and that kind of behavior is repugnant. There should be a penalty for it. $30,000 is maybe a bit steep, given that what he did caused no injury to anyone, but I think some punishment is just.
sycophantman
What was so galvanizing about Joe Horn was that there wasn't any gray area in this. It was a transparent and blatant attempt to market himself in a sport that values team more than any other sport.
December 18, 2003 at 04:56AM View BBCode
Something has to be done, but it's such a thorny issue. It so subjective what constitutes 'showboating'.What was so galvanizing about Joe Horn was that there wasn't any gray area in this. It was a transparent and blatant attempt to market himself in a sport that values team more than any other sport.
happy
sycophant, i gotta agree, just say showboating is ok, but that means anyone can come up an flatten you and wont get fined.
December 18, 2003 at 05:13AM View BBCode
my dad said when he played football, only one person ever showboated (and it wasnt even close to this bad) and on the next play he was in, he got flattened when he wasnt in the play and the ref wasnt looking, and had to be taken off the field. that is what should happen. someone like horn needs to be in the endzone calling his mommy, and next thing you know, some Defensive Tackle comes at full speed and flattens you. hey horn, try calling your mom from the emergancy room.sycophant, i gotta agree, just say showboating is ok, but that means anyone can come up an flatten you and wont get fined.
happy
December 18, 2003 at 05:13AM View BBCode
oh, and Duff, congrats, you are right now exactly on post 1000
sycophantman
How great would it be, Terrell Owens tried to strut right on the Dallas star in mid-field a couple of years ago and was smacked down. I loved it, and it's one of my fondest remembered games that I had the chance to watch.
(best: that miraculous Buffalo comeback against Houston back in, what, 1993? fantastic!)
December 18, 2003 at 05:19AM View BBCode
Let the league police itself, that's what I say.How great would it be, Terrell Owens tried to strut right on the Dallas star in mid-field a couple of years ago and was smacked down. I loved it, and it's one of my fondest remembered games that I had the chance to watch.
(best: that miraculous Buffalo comeback against Houston back in, what, 1993? fantastic!)
Duff77
Now I'm not particularly in favor of physical punishment--I generally consider it barbaric (the well-placed, not-too-painful dope-slap excluded), but I am in favor of punishing asinine behavior. But if you do that, every liberal from here to Honolulu will scream about the first amendment or something. And I AM a liberal (about the biggest one you'll ever meet), but c'mon, we've got to have a FEW rules, don't we? A FEW rules of conduct such that we might insure a certain level of social dignity? Such as, I don't know, NOT racing up my ass at 85 MPH and then giving me the finger for not getting out of YOUR way...
But you can't do it anymore. Parents can't, or won't discipline their children, and when they do, it's "Go to your room!" (with a TV, DVD player, and video games). So is it any surprise so many people grow up to be jackasses? And once they become adult jackasses it's impossible to discipline them. Why? Because all the other jackasses out there think it's funny. The reason it's socially acceptable for a linebacker to do a little dance after knocking a quarterback unconscious is that WAY too many people think it's damned entertaining. And shocking as it may be to discover, these people are breeding.
Sure it's stuffy and old-fashioned, but the basic foundation of a civilized society is common respect for one another and the institutions we cherish. Lose that, and everything unravels. Joe Horn disrespected himself, his team, the opposing team, and any fan that thinks football is actually a serious matter. You canā??t put someoneā??s right of expression in a straight-jacket, but if there arenā??t penalties for being a dumbass, then everyone will be. $30,000 is a nice dope-slap.
December 18, 2003 at 05:23AM View BBCode
Back in the good old days (which I'm not old enough to know about), if your kid did something like Joe Horn did, you gave him a nice friendly dope-slap. If they got pissy about it, you beat 'em with your belt. Although this did not entirely prevent people from being total jackasses, it certainly kept more people in line than now, when EVERYONE is a total jackass ALL THE TIME.Now I'm not particularly in favor of physical punishment--I generally consider it barbaric (the well-placed, not-too-painful dope-slap excluded), but I am in favor of punishing asinine behavior. But if you do that, every liberal from here to Honolulu will scream about the first amendment or something. And I AM a liberal (about the biggest one you'll ever meet), but c'mon, we've got to have a FEW rules, don't we? A FEW rules of conduct such that we might insure a certain level of social dignity? Such as, I don't know, NOT racing up my ass at 85 MPH and then giving me the finger for not getting out of YOUR way...
But you can't do it anymore. Parents can't, or won't discipline their children, and when they do, it's "Go to your room!" (with a TV, DVD player, and video games). So is it any surprise so many people grow up to be jackasses? And once they become adult jackasses it's impossible to discipline them. Why? Because all the other jackasses out there think it's funny. The reason it's socially acceptable for a linebacker to do a little dance after knocking a quarterback unconscious is that WAY too many people think it's damned entertaining. And shocking as it may be to discover, these people are breeding.
Sure it's stuffy and old-fashioned, but the basic foundation of a civilized society is common respect for one another and the institutions we cherish. Lose that, and everything unravels. Joe Horn disrespected himself, his team, the opposing team, and any fan that thinks football is actually a serious matter. You canā??t put someoneā??s right of expression in a straight-jacket, but if there arenā??t penalties for being a dumbass, then everyone will be. $30,000 is a nice dope-slap.
happy
anyway, for me, i dont care if it is pissing off the other team as much as that it is pissing off me. why should bruce smith be calling his agent after breaking the sack record? why should Joe Horn be calling his mom? why should TO be signing a football and giving it to his agent during the game? what would happen if any of this had been done by the players under some of the old coaches? i had hoped that Parcells would teach his team some discipline and set an example, and while i think their team is much better at not showboating than any other team, it is still there. I was so happy when Keshawn was sat for being an asshole. i wish that wouldve happened for Darnarian McCants by now. he is the #3 reciever, and never seems to get open except for a touchdown (probably doesnt try until he knows he can do a dance) then goes in and dances and just altogether acts like an ass. it seems like every time he gets the ball and it isnt a touchdown, he has to turn around to the CB and talk trash to him, and ends up getting a 15 yard penalty on him.
December 18, 2003 at 05:26AM View BBCode
wait, did that really happen, or you wanted it to happen? didnt totally understand that.anyway, for me, i dont care if it is pissing off the other team as much as that it is pissing off me. why should bruce smith be calling his agent after breaking the sack record? why should Joe Horn be calling his mom? why should TO be signing a football and giving it to his agent during the game? what would happen if any of this had been done by the players under some of the old coaches? i had hoped that Parcells would teach his team some discipline and set an example, and while i think their team is much better at not showboating than any other team, it is still there. I was so happy when Keshawn was sat for being an asshole. i wish that wouldve happened for Darnarian McCants by now. he is the #3 reciever, and never seems to get open except for a touchdown (probably doesnt try until he knows he can do a dance) then goes in and dances and just altogether acts like an ass. it seems like every time he gets the ball and it isnt a touchdown, he has to turn around to the CB and talk trash to him, and ends up getting a 15 yard penalty on him.
sycophantman
The attitudes of the younger generation is generally one of selfishness.
But it's in response to parents who were considered too strict by their kids. Those kids grow up to be overly permissive (baby boomers) and give birth to a generation of whiners. This generation gives birth to a more conservative genration in response to the lax attention. and so it goes...
In ten to 15 years this society is going to be much different than it is now, and not just because of 9-11....
December 18, 2003 at 05:29AM View BBCode
You know, this all goes in cycles...The attitudes of the younger generation is generally one of selfishness.
But it's in response to parents who were considered too strict by their kids. Those kids grow up to be overly permissive (baby boomers) and give birth to a generation of whiners. This generation gives birth to a more conservative genration in response to the lax attention. and so it goes...
In ten to 15 years this society is going to be much different than it is now, and not just because of 9-11....
happy
here is what i have to say about the first amendmant. what Horn did has nothing to do with the first amendment. I cant use my cell phone at work, he isnt allowed to do it either. im not allowed to do a dance every time i finish a customer. this isnt freedom of speech.
also, freedom of speech can be abriged when you are on someone elses property. i am not allowed to curse at school. it is their property, it is their rules. im not allowed to hand out flyers for the next neo nazi convention inside businesses. freedom of speech doesnt apply in the stadium. they can make a rule that you cant root for the other team in their stadium, and kick out or fine someone who breaks the rule, it is their property, it is their rules.
December 18, 2003 at 05:54AM View BBCode
i started my post before duffs came up.here is what i have to say about the first amendmant. what Horn did has nothing to do with the first amendment. I cant use my cell phone at work, he isnt allowed to do it either. im not allowed to do a dance every time i finish a customer. this isnt freedom of speech.
also, freedom of speech can be abriged when you are on someone elses property. i am not allowed to curse at school. it is their property, it is their rules. im not allowed to hand out flyers for the next neo nazi convention inside businesses. freedom of speech doesnt apply in the stadium. they can make a rule that you cant root for the other team in their stadium, and kick out or fine someone who breaks the rule, it is their property, it is their rules.
Duff77
December 18, 2003 at 05:57AM View BBCode
Absolutely. On a much more basic level, the NFL has a rule and he broke it, so he gets punished...period. They'd be making a joke out of their own rules if they didn't fine him.
happy
December 18, 2003 at 06:04AM View BBCode
yup, but fining really isnt enough for me. what is however million -30,000 answer, not much difference
ME
December 18, 2003 at 03:56PM View BBCode
No fine. The refs should be "encouraged" to look the other way during the rest of the game and let him get flattened. It's like in baseball, you bean one of ours, we bean one of yours.
jigakoeochiro
December 18, 2003 at 03:58PM View BBCode
that was a classic orgianal trick. there is npthing wrong with it, it wasnt bragging or taunting or over-celebration. thats the last thing i thought would have been fined.
BravesLuver
It's football. Intensity is high. That's what happens. Now I want to see Derek Jeter hit a homer and call his parents after crossing the plate :D
December 18, 2003 at 04:28PM View BBCode
Horn is classic.It's football. Intensity is high. That's what happens. Now I want to see Derek Jeter hit a homer and call his parents after crossing the plate :D
skierdude44
December 18, 2003 at 08:24PM View BBCode
i think that everyone is taking his cell phone call way too seriously. this is a game, its supposed to be entertaining. i thought it wuz funny and the announcers' first reaction wuz to laugh. these guys are not only athletes but they are entertainers. i mean come on they have britney spears opening up monday night football so they obviously want it to be entertaining (not that britney spears is entertaining.) the league also isnt consistent with these fines and unsportsman like conduct penalties. i see all these DBs doing dances after an interception, they dont get called for a penalty and they dont get fined, i see these d linemen dancing after a sack but they dont get fined or called for a penalty, all these receivers make the first down signal when ever they get a first down and dont get fined or called for anything. but if u go up with ur finger to slit ur throat u get fined. and chad johnson got fined for his sign which i thought wuz funny too and it isnt harmful bcuz all he wuz doing wuz making fun of himself. its entertainment, so let them entertain us. happy u saying that at ur job u cant use ur cell phone or curse or dance after u check out a customer is like saying george carlin cant curse during his routine. joe horn, TO, and chad johnson dont work in the food lion or wutever so they have different requirements. their job is to be entertaining, and i think that those dances and signs are entertaining. even some of the giants thought it wuz funny. but i do agree that if a guy showboats u should be allowed to deck him.
Cubsfan13
December 19, 2003 at 12:40AM View BBCode
I don't mind a little dance or something like that (I admit, on occasion when I score a touchdown in a pick up game I do a small dance) but the cell phone crap was obviously previously thought out and was meant to draw attention. It was a little funny but I don't really like it.
Duff77
December 19, 2003 at 04:40AM View BBCode
He's just a guy being a dick in order to draw attention to himself. And if you think it's funny, then he succeeded.
andrew
You have got to be kidding me?!?! Please tell me you find her at least somewhat entertaining :o
And as for Horn... pathetic. He was trying to be funny and original, but ended up looking like an ass and being unoriginal as well, because it was a clear OT ripoff.
These types of things almost make me miss the dances and the spur of the moment celebrations, were a guy was just happy that he scored. Now they are using it for premotion. OT was enough This premeditated stuff has got to stop.
*realises that the NFL is not going to read this thread before handing out next fine* :(
December 19, 2003 at 05:33AM View BBCode
Originally posted by skierdude44
(not that britney spears is entertaining.)
You have got to be kidding me?!?! Please tell me you find her at least somewhat entertaining :o
And as for Horn... pathetic. He was trying to be funny and original, but ended up looking like an ass and being unoriginal as well, because it was a clear OT ripoff.
These types of things almost make me miss the dances and the spur of the moment celebrations, were a guy was just happy that he scored. Now they are using it for premotion. OT was enough This premeditated stuff has got to stop.
*realises that the NFL is not going to read this thread before handing out next fine* :(
sycophantman
I read a psychological study about football players once that was very interesting. It found that football recievers almost always are flamboyant and egotistic, its just the type of personality that position attracts.
But its a bad thing, what he did. How is he going to make that play, that whole game, the whole New Orleans season mostly about him. He never scores a single TD without a line blocking for him, without a QB throwing him the ball, without a runnning back drawing LB coverage. How does he get off thinking that its all about him? Jerk...
December 19, 2003 at 04:04PM View BBCode
It's almost always recievers who get blasted for excessive showboating.I read a psychological study about football players once that was very interesting. It found that football recievers almost always are flamboyant and egotistic, its just the type of personality that position attracts.
But its a bad thing, what he did. How is he going to make that play, that whole game, the whole New Orleans season mostly about him. He never scores a single TD without a line blocking for him, without a QB throwing him the ball, without a runnning back drawing LB coverage. How does he get off thinking that its all about him? Jerk...
skierdude44
December 21, 2003 at 12:59AM View BBCode
obviously they didnt care that much bcuz michael lewis helped him pull it off by lifting up the pad and helping him find it. o and to rephrase my britney spears comment, her MUSIC isnt entertaining.
Cubsfan13
"It's almost always recievers who get blasted for excessive showboating.
I read a psychological study about football players once that was very interesting. It found that football recievers almost always are flamboyant and egotistic, its just the type of personality that position attracts."
LMFAO, I play receiver and corner, so half the time I agree with you but the other half of the time I think its BS.
December 21, 2003 at 03:08AM View BBCode
"It's almost always recievers who get blasted for excessive showboating.
I read a psychological study about football players once that was very interesting. It found that football recievers almost always are flamboyant and egotistic, its just the type of personality that position attracts."
LMFAO, I play receiver and corner, so half the time I agree with you but the other half of the time I think its BS.
sycophantman
Man, that's gotta be rough for you cubsfan!
But imagine if you were splitting time between O-line and reciever.
I need to congradulate my teammates...
...for having ME on the team...
...because without their help...
...I wouldn't be able to carry this team to the playoffs...
:rolleyes:
December 21, 2003 at 12:34PM View BBCode
:lol:Man, that's gotta be rough for you cubsfan!
But imagine if you were splitting time between O-line and reciever.
I need to congradulate my teammates...
...for having ME on the team...
...because without their help...
...I wouldn't be able to carry this team to the playoffs...
:rolleyes:
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