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texasbluebird
Bob Huggins signs with Kansas State as their head coach under a 5-year contract. Let the drinking Begin!!!!!!
Bob Huggins is back!!!!!!!
March 23, 2006 at 10:07PM View BBCode
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=2380885Bob Huggins signs with Kansas State as their head coach under a 5-year contract. Let the drinking Begin!!!!!!
lvnwrth
Before Cincinnati he coached in Canton and Akron. All are significantly larger than Manhattan. Canton is about twice as large; Akron is about 10 times as large; Cincinnati isn't even a comparision. In Manhattan he won't have the Bengals and the Reds and all of the other stuff you have in a major metropolitan area to divert folks' attention. He will be the show from the end of football season till spring practice starts.
Here's hoping Huggins really wants to rehabilitate his reputation. If so, he might be a good fit at K-State.
March 23, 2006 at 11:13PM View BBCode
This should come as very good news to Missouri fans, who were living in mortal fear that Huggins would be the next coach at Mizzou. For Huggins' sake, I hope he's cleaned up his act. Having a roster of thugs and drunks with a graduation rate in single digits, and driving drunk himself, will not play well in Manhattan, KS.Before Cincinnati he coached in Canton and Akron. All are significantly larger than Manhattan. Canton is about twice as large; Akron is about 10 times as large; Cincinnati isn't even a comparision. In Manhattan he won't have the Bengals and the Reds and all of the other stuff you have in a major metropolitan area to divert folks' attention. He will be the show from the end of football season till spring practice starts.
Here's hoping Huggins really wants to rehabilitate his reputation. If so, he might be a good fit at K-State.
FuriousGiorge
March 23, 2006 at 11:26PM View BBCode
We all know exactly what K-State is getting here, and I'm positive that so do they. You don't hire Bob Huggins because you want to add a valuable member to your university's faculty for the next 25 years - you hire him because you're tired of being a Big 12 doormat, and really tired of losing to Kansas every year, especially now that your football team is just as lousy as theirs. There's not going to be any cleaning up of Huggins' act, because he was hired by a program without a whole lot of other options if they want to win. Hiring Huggins simply shows that they are prepared to win at any cost. Either he will win and the University will ignore the fact that they've turned into a dirty program (which they will) or else they'll lose and the University will all of a sudden get a conscience and fire him, ostensibly because of the internal problems in the program, but really because the team wasn't winning.
lvnwrth
K-State is not a "win at any cost" school and never has been. They may suck, but they suck honestly.
March 23, 2006 at 11:30PM View BBCode
It's clear you have never lived in Manhattan and know nothing about the demographics or sociology of central Kansas. I believe that Huggins did a mea culpa and made lots of promises that he's different now than when Cincinnati fired him. Otherwise he wouldn't be there.K-State is not a "win at any cost" school and never has been. They may suck, but they suck honestly.
FuriousGiorge
I live in Blacksburg - trust me, it's the same place.
I'm sure Bob Huggins made lots of promises. I'm also positive that he will not follow through on any of them. If the people who hired him honestly believe that he will change, I am left scratching my head at how someone so monstrously gullible could have risen that far. The second K-State hired someone with the (deserved) poison reputation of Bob Huggins, they became a win at any cost school.
March 23, 2006 at 11:34PM View BBCode
Originally posted by lvnwrth
It's clear you have never lived in Manhattan and know nothing about the demographics or sociology of central Kansas. I believe that Huggins did a mea culpa and made lots of promises that he's different now than when Cincinnati fired him. Otherwise he wouldn't be there.
K-State is not a "win at any cost" school and never has been. They may suck, but they suck honestly.
I live in Blacksburg - trust me, it's the same place.
I'm sure Bob Huggins made lots of promises. I'm also positive that he will not follow through on any of them. If the people who hired him honestly believe that he will change, I am left scratching my head at how someone so monstrously gullible could have risen that far. The second K-State hired someone with the (deserved) poison reputation of Bob Huggins, they became a win at any cost school.
lvnwrth
March 23, 2006 at 11:43PM View BBCode
Even in Blacksburg they finally kicked Marcus Vick off the team. Every place has its limits.
FuriousGiorge
I'm not making a moral judgment on what K-State did. Huggins isn't necessarily a terrible person, but he runs a loose program and he's prone to big lapses in judgment. But don't be naive - the University didn't hire Huggins because they were looking for a fine, upstanding citizen to guide their program, and they are absolutely going to look the other way if the basketball team is winning.
March 23, 2006 at 11:53PM View BBCode
Coaches are different. Even in the best situation, a player is only going to give you 4 years, so turnover is a constant no matter what. But with a coach, if he's winning, or even just giving the semblance of winning, it becomes VERY difficult for the AD to fire him because of the influence of the boosters. I mean, unless he's getting loaded and driving his car into the University President's pool, it's very hard to oust a coach who is winning in a place with no tradition of winning. Rationalization is easy - "every school has minor NCAA violations", "Coach Huggins is simply trying to help a troubled kid get his life together", "One mistake behind the wheel shouldn't be enough to get a man fired". Get used to those sorts of things.I'm not making a moral judgment on what K-State did. Huggins isn't necessarily a terrible person, but he runs a loose program and he's prone to big lapses in judgment. But don't be naive - the University didn't hire Huggins because they were looking for a fine, upstanding citizen to guide their program, and they are absolutely going to look the other way if the basketball team is winning.
lvnwrth
Except K-State has a long tradition of winning. It ended when Lon Kruger left for Florida; or I suppose, when Dana Altman resigned and went to Creighton. Why did he resign to coach at a mid-major? Because a 68-54 record in four seasons, and only one NCAA bid weren't good enough at K-State. In fact, in their 2005 college basketball annual, Street & Smith's listed K-State 22nd among the 100 greatest college basketball programs of all time in 2005.
You may be right. The boosters who remember those days have gone a long time without an NCAA tournament bid. The last one was in 1996 or 1997...somewhere along in there...when Tom Asbury was the coach. They may have told the administration to win, whatever it takes. But I'll still be surprised if Jon Wefald and Tim Weiser put up with the stuff that happened in Cincinnati.
March 24, 2006 at 12:37AM View BBCode
"....it's very hard to oust a coach who is winning in a place with no tradition of winning."Except K-State has a long tradition of winning. It ended when Lon Kruger left for Florida; or I suppose, when Dana Altman resigned and went to Creighton. Why did he resign to coach at a mid-major? Because a 68-54 record in four seasons, and only one NCAA bid weren't good enough at K-State. In fact, in their 2005 college basketball annual, Street & Smith's listed K-State 22nd among the 100 greatest college basketball programs of all time in 2005.
You may be right. The boosters who remember those days have gone a long time without an NCAA tournament bid. The last one was in 1996 or 1997...somewhere along in there...when Tom Asbury was the coach. They may have told the administration to win, whatever it takes. But I'll still be surprised if Jon Wefald and Tim Weiser put up with the stuff that happened in Cincinnati.
ShaggySanchez
I guess you would assume that Coach K is a bad guy because in 1998 they only had a 25% grad rate. It must have been a bunch of thugs on that team that led to them not graduating.
March 24, 2006 at 01:10AM View BBCode
lvnwrth, you need to check your facts a little about Huggins. He has never had a zero graduation rate, the fact that JUCO players don't count toward your graduation rate is a joke considering he recruits mostly juco players. Also players that leave early and come back to graduate later don't count unles they do it in a certain amount of time. I would also like to ask how it is that he has a zero graduation rate when players like K. Martin and S. Logan both graduated. He has had a few players that got into trouble but for the most part his players aren't nearly as bad as the media makes them out to be. The truth is that Kentucky has actually had more problems with players getting in trouble the last 5 years than UC has but UK doesn't have the reputation of having thugs so it doesn't get nearly as much play. I would like to note I am not a UC or Huggins fan but live in the area and know that much of what is reported in national media is way overblown and exagerrated.I guess you would assume that Coach K is a bad guy because in 1998 they only had a 25% grad rate. It must have been a bunch of thugs on that team that led to them not graduating.
lvnwrth
The fact that he recruits mostly juco players speaks volumes. Most juco players are kids who couldn't get into a 4-year school...usually for academics, sometimes because of other "problems". When that's your recruiting base, you're begging for trouble. This is from the Cincinnati preview on Big East website BEFORE Huggins was dismissed last summer:
"Assistant Coach Keith LeGree was arrested for DUI, promising sophomore-to-be Roy Bright was dismissed from the team when he was arrested for carrying a fully loaded gun on campus, Vincent Banks did not make the grades, recruit Tyree Evans, who is not on the roster, has had sexual misconduct allegations levied against him at his prep school..."
That HAS to raise some concerns about the kind of kids Huggins recruits, and the people he hires to work for him. Also, I never said he had a zero graduation rate. I said "single digit" graduation rate.
From Cincinnati preview on Big East website BEFORE Huggins was dismissed last summer:
"He has come under fire around the nation for poor graduation rates..."
From ESPN's Steve Delsohn:
?We're looking at whether the criteria is questionable, and we used Cincinnati as a case study because they are frequently labeled with that zero graduation rate. What struck me is that when you walk into the basketball office, you see these pictures of 15 graduates ? and yet how can that be if they supposedly have a zero graduation rate??
Some folks HAVE said that Cincinnati had a ZERO graduation rate. Perhaps that's why you think I said that.
[Edited on 3-24-2006 by lvnwrth]
March 24, 2006 at 03:30PM View BBCode
Originally posted by ShaggySanchez
lvnwrth, you need to check your facts a little about Huggins. He has never had a zero graduation rate, the fact that JUCO players don't count toward your graduation rate is a joke considering he recruits mostly juco players.
The fact that he recruits mostly juco players speaks volumes. Most juco players are kids who couldn't get into a 4-year school...usually for academics, sometimes because of other "problems". When that's your recruiting base, you're begging for trouble. This is from the Cincinnati preview on Big East website BEFORE Huggins was dismissed last summer:
"Assistant Coach Keith LeGree was arrested for DUI, promising sophomore-to-be Roy Bright was dismissed from the team when he was arrested for carrying a fully loaded gun on campus, Vincent Banks did not make the grades, recruit Tyree Evans, who is not on the roster, has had sexual misconduct allegations levied against him at his prep school..."
That HAS to raise some concerns about the kind of kids Huggins recruits, and the people he hires to work for him. Also, I never said he had a zero graduation rate. I said "single digit" graduation rate.
From Cincinnati preview on Big East website BEFORE Huggins was dismissed last summer:
"He has come under fire around the nation for poor graduation rates..."
From ESPN's Steve Delsohn:
?We're looking at whether the criteria is questionable, and we used Cincinnati as a case study because they are frequently labeled with that zero graduation rate. What struck me is that when you walk into the basketball office, you see these pictures of 15 graduates ? and yet how can that be if they supposedly have a zero graduation rate??
Some folks HAVE said that Cincinnati had a ZERO graduation rate. Perhaps that's why you think I said that.
[Edited on 3-24-2006 by lvnwrth]
lvnwrth
Yeah, I butchered that pretty good...pulled a "Zags", so to speak.
Corrected...hopefully its easier on the eyes. Sorry 'bout that.
March 24, 2006 at 04:15PM View BBCode
Originally posted by FuriousGiorge
Those quote boxes were confusing.
Yeah, I butchered that pretty good...pulled a "Zags", so to speak.
Corrected...hopefully its easier on the eyes. Sorry 'bout that.
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