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shep1582
1) If there are two veteran owners involved, and no signs of collusion, a protest should not be posted.
2) If it is not a terrible trade that upsets the balance of the league. Before Admin makes a thread in the league stating the protest, have an unbiased eye look at it (bart, deke, tm4559, roosters, hammy, etc). All trades will have at least a tiny slant to them, and depending on what you think of prospects v. vets will make you think one guy got the better of it. Owners in a league will of necessity have a vested interest in a team they are competing against not getting a few pieces to make them better. That's not grounds for protest, IMO.
3) Admin should contact the two owners involved in the trade and ask for an explanation. Something like this : "Before we allow a formal protest to be posted in your league, we would like to know your reasoning behind this trade." Both owners can give their reasons, and if it sounds logical, and as if the owners know what they were getting, the trade should stand.
4) Protests should be because of "newbie rape" or collusion, not personal axe grinding, or sour grapes because one team got better and is now in a better position to win.
I would appreciate any and all intelligent opinions here, whether you agree with me or not. IMO, it's too easy to protest a trade, and it only leads to dissension when it's not a legitimate protest.
Trade protest parameters
May 19, 2010 at 07:06PM View BBCode
I'll not name the league or post the trades, but I will ask for something to be done about trade protests that have no business being lodged.1) If there are two veteran owners involved, and no signs of collusion, a protest should not be posted.
2) If it is not a terrible trade that upsets the balance of the league. Before Admin makes a thread in the league stating the protest, have an unbiased eye look at it (bart, deke, tm4559, roosters, hammy, etc). All trades will have at least a tiny slant to them, and depending on what you think of prospects v. vets will make you think one guy got the better of it. Owners in a league will of necessity have a vested interest in a team they are competing against not getting a few pieces to make them better. That's not grounds for protest, IMO.
3) Admin should contact the two owners involved in the trade and ask for an explanation. Something like this : "Before we allow a formal protest to be posted in your league, we would like to know your reasoning behind this trade." Both owners can give their reasons, and if it sounds logical, and as if the owners know what they were getting, the trade should stand.
4) Protests should be because of "newbie rape" or collusion, not personal axe grinding, or sour grapes because one team got better and is now in a better position to win.
I would appreciate any and all intelligent opinions here, whether you agree with me or not. IMO, it's too easy to protest a trade, and it only leads to dissension when it's not a legitimate protest.
Admin
In general, I prefer a league to decide what is best for itself in terms of reversing trades.
We used to do some looking at trades before announcing the complaint. This tended to shift the dissension towards Admin when we didn't agree with the initial complaint, and it took a lot of our time to come to these conclusions. We spent a lot of time and energy explaining to a complainer why his protest was not taken seriously when XYZ protest was taken seriously. It got to the point where we were doing little on the site besides dealing with trade protests.
The process we have in place is fairly easy for us to facilitate, though I do agree that an unwarranted complaint can cause dissension. I might argue that the complaint is merely a manifestation of some existing dissension rather than the cause.
If a private league wants to try a different process for trade protests, I'd be very happy to let them try it. Many good changes to the game and policy have come about because private leagues have tried different rules - when they work, those rules tend to spread like wildfire to the point where we adopt them site-wide.
Tyson
[Edited on 5-19-2010 by Admin]
[Edited on 5-19-2010 by Admin]
May 19, 2010 at 07:22PM View BBCode
Hi,In general, I prefer a league to decide what is best for itself in terms of reversing trades.
We used to do some looking at trades before announcing the complaint. This tended to shift the dissension towards Admin when we didn't agree with the initial complaint, and it took a lot of our time to come to these conclusions. We spent a lot of time and energy explaining to a complainer why his protest was not taken seriously when XYZ protest was taken seriously. It got to the point where we were doing little on the site besides dealing with trade protests.
The process we have in place is fairly easy for us to facilitate, though I do agree that an unwarranted complaint can cause dissension. I might argue that the complaint is merely a manifestation of some existing dissension rather than the cause.
If a private league wants to try a different process for trade protests, I'd be very happy to let them try it. Many good changes to the game and policy have come about because private leagues have tried different rules - when they work, those rules tend to spread like wildfire to the point where we adopt them site-wide.
Tyson
[Edited on 5-19-2010 by Admin]
[Edited on 5-19-2010 by Admin]
shep1582
If a protest is lodged, I think the protester should have to identify himself and not hide behind anonymity. I think the frivolous protests would stop if this were true. It's easy to disrupt the league with this stuff if you can do it from behind a curtain.
May 19, 2010 at 07:34PM View BBCode
I understand. If that's your position, then why aren't trade protests forwarded to the commish, and then have him discuss it with the owners involved, instead of admin going straight to the boards with it?If a protest is lodged, I think the protester should have to identify himself and not hide behind anonymity. I think the frivolous protests would stop if this were true. It's easy to disrupt the league with this stuff if you can do it from behind a curtain.
Admin
Unfortunately, all of this takes time and energy. And I'm not certain if all that time and energy would result in a better overall process. You could argue that it would, I'm not sure that would be the case. But in any event, we don't have the staff to be able to support something like that with the current pricing structure.
I'm not sure whether announcing who the complainer is would be better or worse. I suspect it might result in slightly less complaints, but much more friction with each complaint. If you are in a private league that wants to adopt this policy, I'd be willing to try it. We'd need to conduct a league vote to make this rule change, have your commish contact me if there is interest.
Tyson
[Edited on 5-19-2010 by Admin]
May 19, 2010 at 07:49PM View BBCode
then why aren't trade protests forwarded to the commish, and then have him discuss it with the owners involved, instead of admin going straight to the boards with it?There would be two outcomes, the commish agrees and files the complaint with Admin, or the commish disagrees and says don't file the complaint. If the commish says don't file the complaint, many times I suspect we will then receive a complaint on the commish. We then have to dig into the trade, discuss things with the commish, and make a decision.
Unfortunately, all of this takes time and energy. And I'm not certain if all that time and energy would result in a better overall process. You could argue that it would, I'm not sure that would be the case. But in any event, we don't have the staff to be able to support something like that with the current pricing structure.
I'm not sure whether announcing who the complainer is would be better or worse. I suspect it might result in slightly less complaints, but much more friction with each complaint. If you are in a private league that wants to adopt this policy, I'd be willing to try it. We'd need to conduct a league vote to make this rule change, have your commish contact me if there is interest.
Tyson
[Edited on 5-19-2010 by Admin]
barterer2002
May 20, 2010 at 12:17PM View formatted
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There are certainly some trades that I see protested that I don't think should be (and I usually say so). Truthfully though the load of the number of trades that I look at monthly isn't too great. Not sure who else, if anyone, is looking at deals but I'd guess I look at 3-5 a month for all leagues. Certain leagues come up more often than others and often will have more than one at a time but sitewide I don't think there is too much in terms of unwarranted things. Usually the ones that really have no business are ones where the league has a bunch of players new from trial leagues that don't understand development and protest the trade of a 35 year old A- player for a 2nd round pick kind of thing. Most of these get weeded out ahead of time simply because it takes 3 protests to get to the review level so its never a matter of just one owner with an axe to grind.
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