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toolman_fixit
new idea for American league
February 08, 2011 at 09:16PM View BBCode
Again I know this site is trying to mimic old time baseball but I think it would be a huge improvement if the DH was added to the American league like present day baseball. You would be introducing a whole lot of new scenarios to manage. One year the world series could have a DH the next no DH and so on. Or if that is not acceptable then to follow the site in a league I can see no DH in the early years of a league like 1950 etc but when the league year goes into the 1970's or whenever the DH was really added then it should be available to the league.
dirtdevil
February 08, 2011 at 09:25PM View BBCode
i have long been in favour of the DH both in SD and real life. however, there are enough people opposed to it that i don't forsee it coming to SD as anything other than an option for private leagues.
chance4103
February 08, 2011 at 11:40PM View BBCode
I am all in favor of a DH but in both the American and National league.
dabigtrain
[Edited on 2-9-2011 by dabigtrain]
February 09, 2011 at 04:39PM View BBCode
I think the DH should be eradicated at all levels of organized baseball, simlulated or otherwise...[Edited on 2-9-2011 by dabigtrain]
dirtdevil
February 10, 2011 at 01:45AM View BBCode
watching double-switches and pitchers hitting was stage 3 of the interrogation process at guantanamo. no one ever made it to stage 4. true story.
tm4559
February 10, 2011 at 06:50PM View BBCode
they can't hit. therefore, they should stop trying. for the children.
dirtdevil
*audbile thump as announcer passes out from the excitement*
February 10, 2011 at 07:34PM View BBCode
oh my god! look at THAT!!! THE BACKUP LEFTFIELDER IS GOING TO BAT IN THE PITCHER"S SPOT IN THE LINEUP!!!!!!! THE NEW LEFTHANDED RELIEVER IS GOING TO BAT IN THE #5 SLOT!!!!!!!!!*audbile thump as announcer passes out from the excitement*
tm4559
February 10, 2011 at 07:54PM View BBCode
yes, they do treasure the awesomely nonawesome and monumentally boring double switch. when the expos first moved to washington (yeah, the expos) frank robinson used to do it sometime in the third inning. anything to get The Chop into the game.
barterer2002
There is strategy in when to remove a pitcher in the NL. Do you leave in the guy who is starting to get hit but due up first the next inning or pull him now and if so, do you double switch bringing in a lesser outfielder/catcher or whatever to bat in the 9 hole. Do you pinch hit for the guy who is throwing an improbably no hitter in the 8th inning when the score is 0-0 and the opposing pitcher is a Santana/Lincecum/Halladay type where you assume you've gotten the most out of your guy or let him keep going on the theory that many crappy pitchers have caught lightning in a bottle for one day.
In the AL its simple and no strategy. Your pitcher starts getting hit you pull him for reliever after reliever after reliever without thoughts. Its not just the hitting part and contending that it is is foolish on your part.
February 10, 2011 at 10:19PM View BBCode
Look you two, you've grown up with the AL and so think its superior. You see the only strategy as being when to pinch hit and you're wrong but can't admit it.There is strategy in when to remove a pitcher in the NL. Do you leave in the guy who is starting to get hit but due up first the next inning or pull him now and if so, do you double switch bringing in a lesser outfielder/catcher or whatever to bat in the 9 hole. Do you pinch hit for the guy who is throwing an improbably no hitter in the 8th inning when the score is 0-0 and the opposing pitcher is a Santana/Lincecum/Halladay type where you assume you've gotten the most out of your guy or let him keep going on the theory that many crappy pitchers have caught lightning in a bottle for one day.
In the AL its simple and no strategy. Your pitcher starts getting hit you pull him for reliever after reliever after reliever without thoughts. Its not just the hitting part and contending that it is is foolish on your part.
dirtdevil
(look, ordinarily i'm perfectly happy to take a concillatory "everyone has the right to their opinion, the DH should be an option only" line on this issue, as evidenced by my original post. but when someone decides to be deliberately inflammatory instead, then i reserve the right to inflame right back. if we happen to be better at it, well that's not our fault is it?)
February 10, 2011 at 11:02PM View BBCode
we've been over this before, bart. we think you're as wrong as you think we are. we're right, of course, but what good does that do us when you refuse to see that?(look, ordinarily i'm perfectly happy to take a concillatory "everyone has the right to their opinion, the DH should be an option only" line on this issue, as evidenced by my original post. but when someone decides to be deliberately inflammatory instead, then i reserve the right to inflame right back. if we happen to be better at it, well that's not our fault is it?)
celamantia
Plus, writing that code would mean going to the Dark Side. :)
February 10, 2011 at 11:32PM View BBCode
Bart does bring up an issue, though... it's not simply a matter of adding a batter in place of a pitcher, new bullpen logic would have to be written as well.Plus, writing that code would mean going to the Dark Side. :)
barterer2002
Tell me any strategy at all that can be attributed to the DH. Is it the strategy to move a great fielder like David Ortiz out of the field. No thats not it. Is it a strategy to give your offensive catchers a "day off" while still keeping their productive bats in the lineup? No that's not it. Is it whether to let a pitcher go another inning to get to his spot in the lineup? No, that's now irrelevant.
What the DH does is make the lineups push button.
You and Tim will minimize the strategy impact because you have to. You cannot argue that there is any strategy with the DH so you have to argue that strategy is unimportant. I get that. I don't think you really believe it but I understand why you do it.
February 11, 2011 at 01:14AM View BBCode
Deke you confuse being bombastic with being better at inflaming.Tell me any strategy at all that can be attributed to the DH. Is it the strategy to move a great fielder like David Ortiz out of the field. No thats not it. Is it a strategy to give your offensive catchers a "day off" while still keeping their productive bats in the lineup? No that's not it. Is it whether to let a pitcher go another inning to get to his spot in the lineup? No, that's now irrelevant.
What the DH does is make the lineups push button.
You and Tim will minimize the strategy impact because you have to. You cannot argue that there is any strategy with the DH so you have to argue that strategy is unimportant. I get that. I don't think you really believe it but I understand why you do it.
dirtdevil
February 11, 2011 at 03:37AM View BBCode
look, we've had this discussion at length in other threads and i don't really know that we need to do it again. i grew up watching both the AL jays and the NL expos more or less equally until i was about 14 when the jays started to dominate the canadian airwves. i've played in far longer in non-DH leagues than in DH ones. the DH is a superior brand of baseball, especially at higher levels where the pitchers really can't hit. i don't agree about the strategy invovled. i also don't think we really need to get into why, as no one is going to change anyone else's mind. i suppose i'd probably do it again, if we have to, but it's just so incredibly tedious.
barterer2002
February 11, 2011 at 04:57PM View BBCode
I don't feel the need to. I'm just not allowing you and Tim to consistently say that DH is better and leave it at that. You claim its a superior game and I disagree. You claim that you don't buy the strategy arguements because you have to say that since you're trying to eliminate strategies while adding none.
tm4559
(as far as getting all choked up about the real life stuff about how long do i leave this thing in the game because it is just battling and pitching to the scoreboard or trying to bring home that no hitter, complete game or shutout (lol, LOL and LMAO on those three counts, respectively) i could just care less really. national league games are just snoozefests. some of that comes from the pitchers just dodging the 4-7spots to get to the freaking eighth hitter and the pitcher. to make up for this little of dance of not challenging these hitters very much, we are offered the spine tingling excitement of the sacrifice bunt, the double switch, and the occasional base runner wearing a jacket. of course we get some clown running into one every now and then, and it makes for a heart warming story on the news. yahoo.
February 11, 2011 at 05:10PM View BBCode
i didn't really say it was better (the DH). i inferred watching national league games was boring. it is boring. for me. i think we should have the DH in sim ball, for a couple of reasons. one is that the pitchers hit even worse than the real life ones do. another is it would give another improvement spot in the majors, which would be a good thing.(as far as getting all choked up about the real life stuff about how long do i leave this thing in the game because it is just battling and pitching to the scoreboard or trying to bring home that no hitter, complete game or shutout (lol, LOL and LMAO on those three counts, respectively) i could just care less really. national league games are just snoozefests. some of that comes from the pitchers just dodging the 4-7spots to get to the freaking eighth hitter and the pitcher. to make up for this little of dance of not challenging these hitters very much, we are offered the spine tingling excitement of the sacrifice bunt, the double switch, and the occasional base runner wearing a jacket. of course we get some clown running into one every now and then, and it makes for a heart warming story on the news. yahoo.
barterer2002
The greatest game I was ever at was circa 1986 in the Astrodome. Nolan Ryan vs Floyd Youmans. Between them they gave up 3 hits through 9 with the Astros winning in the 10th on a Glen Davis solo home run. You call that a snooze fest, I call it much more exciting than a 18-7 game that you love.
February 11, 2011 at 06:34PM View BBCode
Listen, I've always been in favor of the DH being an option in SD leagues. I tend to think that the more variety the better.The greatest game I was ever at was circa 1986 in the Astrodome. Nolan Ryan vs Floyd Youmans. Between them they gave up 3 hits through 9 with the Astros winning in the 10th on a Glen Davis solo home run. You call that a snooze fest, I call it much more exciting than a 18-7 game that you love.
dirtdevil
February 11, 2011 at 07:41PM View BBCode
yes, because there are no pitcher's duels whatsoever in the AL or blowouts in the NL.
tm4559
February 11, 2011 at 07:54PM View BBCode
18-7? that is a cliffhanger loss in baltimore. fans go home happy, we almost won.
Hamilton2
Yes, the AL has pitcher's duels.
Yes, the NL had blowouts.
But the pitching duels in the AL don't create the same strategic situations that the NL game does. The strategy in the AL for a pitcher's duel is "can you go another inning?" Whereas there are many, many more factors in the NL.
I agree with you all that the DH should be an option for simD leagues. I wouldn't even be opposed to allowing a league to do a half-and-half scenario for allowing one of the conferences to use the DL and the other to not. More options the better I say.
But to try to argue that one method of play is superior to the other is a little tacky, IMO. Both have good things, both have bad things. Each of us has a preference. Preferences do not equal superiority.
February 11, 2011 at 08:01PM View BBCode
The bottom line is, in the AL game, the manager doesn't matter much (if any). You set a lineup, you put your best pitcher in the game, and you hope for the best. In the NL, you put together your lineup, start a pitcher and then try to manipulate game conditions to bring about a better result for your team.Yes, the AL has pitcher's duels.
Yes, the NL had blowouts.
But the pitching duels in the AL don't create the same strategic situations that the NL game does. The strategy in the AL for a pitcher's duel is "can you go another inning?" Whereas there are many, many more factors in the NL.
I agree with you all that the DH should be an option for simD leagues. I wouldn't even be opposed to allowing a league to do a half-and-half scenario for allowing one of the conferences to use the DL and the other to not. More options the better I say.
But to try to argue that one method of play is superior to the other is a little tacky, IMO. Both have good things, both have bad things. Each of us has a preference. Preferences do not equal superiority.
tm4559
*giggle*
February 11, 2011 at 08:23PM View BBCode
Originally posted by Hamilton2
In the NL, you put together your lineup, start a pitcher and then try to manipulate game conditions to bring about a better result for your team.
*giggle*
tm4559
February 11, 2011 at 08:25PM View BBCode
(what i am really trying to say is, they should manipulate in one hand, and defecate in the other. and see which one fills up first.)Pages: 1